Ford type 9 gearbox

[bobwhittaker]

I am contemplating fitting a Type 9 gearbox in place of of the Midget unit , however my car is one of the original 138 ( Chassis 123 ) and does not have the later dual option provision . Has anyone any experience of fitting the type 9 to an early chassis , I am particularly interested in knowing whether any cutting and welding of the chassis tubes is needed or can it be done by fabricating a mounting bracket that can sit on and be bolted to the original chassis plate that supports the Midget gearbox . I am aware that complete kits to fit the gearbox to the later cars are available but this is going to be very much a DIY project and any information about clutch release / friction plate / pressure plate etc. ec. would also be very welcome . ( I am currently watching ebay for a bell housig adaptor ) Cheers Bob Whittaker

[Westfield 129]

The really expensive part is the bell housing/adapter. The clutch cover is standard Spridget, with the center hub for the carbon release bearing removed ( a die grinder does this in a couple of minutes). The clutch disc matches the spline count of the output shaft, and is a special part.

It is probably best to order the release bearing and the clutch disc (simply a clutch replacement kit) from one of the specialists handling the type 9/BMC A conversion parts.

You will have to cut off a section of the bell housing to clear the chassis, even on the chassis that are specifically for Type 9 conversions. A detail of the cut (done with a Sawzall) in my build photo album on my WestyXIownersbuildersdrivers site.

I will try to take some measurements, as I have both chassis here.

[bobwhittaker]

Westfield 129 Thanks for the reply , have tried to find your photobuild diary but no luck . Can you give me an address to narrow my
search . Cheers Bob Whittaker

[Westfield 129]

Here is the link to my build photo album in my Westfield XI forum on Yahoo

http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/West ... 1241605228

[Westfield 129]

Here is another link to another W11site with a more comprehensive build album. More images.

http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/west ... 1241634081

[bobwhittaker]

Have " Bit the Bullet " and today ordered a Ford Type 9 conversion kit from Westfield . Having researched various suppliers and prices Westfield are the most favourable by a long way . See www.parts-shop.westfield-sportscars.co.uk . The single cockpit project will have to go on the back burner for a while . Bob Whittaker

[Westfield 129]

Those are both my build albums. If anyone needs any more images, let me know.

The Westfield Type 9 installation/conversion kit is a good one. Just remember to saw off the lump on the starter cavity of the new bell housing so that it wont bump the frame after installation. The pictures of bell housing with the cut off lump are on both build sites. A Sawsall with a metal cutting blade does the trick in a minute.

I acquired my last Type 9 from SP Components. The unit I ordered was the "Long 1st" which makes an excellent close ratio gearbox. I also ordered a short throw shifter. The box arrived promptly and is excellent, with even breaks between gears. Shifting is quick, and positive.

It's expensive compared to a standard Type 9, but 1st gear is much more usable with the 4.22 final driven and the gap between 2 and 3 is gone. It's like having another 10 hp. BGH also has a similar 'box, but SP was far superior in customer service, getting the 'box to me here in the US in short order.

BTW, the lubricant to use in the Type 9 is Redline Shockproof Light. There seems to be some confusion. Lightweight Shockproof works great, and is recommended by SP Components.

[bobwhittaker]

I certainly considered an up rated 1st gear (2.98) but I couldn't justify the extra cost to myself especially considering It is strictly a road car and that I run a 3.9 diff and 14 X 165 tyres so 1st gear is usable anyway . I expect delivery mid January so should be ready for early spring . I have noted the comment regards sawing a lump of the bellhousing ,considering it is a Westfield supplied kit and I made them aware it was for an early car I would expect some guidance from them , however I will wait and see . Cheers Bob Whittaker

[Splat]

Hi Bob,

Two points:

Following the sale of Westfield by Chris some years ago now, I wonder if there is anybody left at Kingswinford who has much knowledge of the differences between the early cars, which must have been out of production for a quarter of a century, and the current Eleven? I suspect that you're on your own there

My later car runs a Westfield supplied T9 kit. It's generic, inasmuch as the bellhousing is a standard casting, being common to all those suppliers offering T9 kits for the Spridget. Although it's tight, the bellhousing doesn't interfere with the chassis on my car. That's not to say that removing the bell wouldn't increase the clearance. As to the clearance on the old chassis, I'll cede to Jan's hands-on knowledge. As it happens, running a high-torque starter motor (thoroughly recommended, especially with a fruity engine), the offending lump is quite superfluous.

ps: Mine has the same ratios as yours, same final-drive and same road-biased usage, albeit on 13" Midget wires. I find it very drivable.

[Westfield 129]

The early car and late car are not that much different. The major chassis difference is the steel dropped floors, shear plates for the rear suspension arms, much shorter dampers, and the supplemental, bolt in, transmission mount plate.

However, the one thing that I didn't do was measure the width of the tunnel, though I don't recall being any difference there between the chassis when taking interior measurements.

The central trans mount of the early car is set to match the standard rib case. I installed a Datsun box in my car, and had to relieve the trans mount plate away to fit the Datsun B210 box, and also relieved (and simplified) the accessory mount that came with the Rivergate Datsun 5 speed conversion kit. It is possible to use a simple Chevy transmission mount in place of the multi part Rivergate mounting system.

A T9 installed into the early chassis will require a new mounting plate to be welded in behind the current ribcase plate. It is likely that the rib case trans mount plate will have to be cut out (or not. Depends on clearance). The supplied T9 rubber transmission mount will have to be cut down to fit between the frame rails at that point, and a new mount plate welded in.

I have re installed the T9 5 speed into three new chassis with the cut to the bell housing to correct the rattle, The rattle occurred during hard cornering, especially on bumpy corners. The problem occurred on both RHD and LHD cars. Now, I just do the cut prior to fitting the engine.

The bell housing can be cut to fit the early chassis if necessary. Also, it may be necessary to move one of the foot box panels inboard on the frame to clear the bell housing (I did this to clear the Datsun transmission. This eliminated hammering on the panel to gain an inch of space at the foot box on the LHD car). It will all be pretty clear once the engine is slid into place. I can supply pictures if necessary.

It would be good to hear from an early chassis owner who has done the T9 conversion.

I use the high torque Honda starter from British Starters, clocked to fit. I use it for the lighter weight and the additional torque. The starter works well, and anything that is smaller and lighter is fine with me. This includes the smaller ND type alternator that fits with a single bolt and a simple turnbuckle for adjustment. $75 for a new one... Weighs less than half what the Lucas weighs, twice the power.